Turkish Air
I am currently returning from a non Tauck trip to Turkey flying direct from Istanbul to Boston. The free Wi-Fi in Business class is nice. I used Turkish Air because I was flying into and out of Istanbul and could get a direct flight. I was also considering using them in the future for Tauck trips to Southeast Asia as well as Africa as an alternative to Qatar or Emirates as I have noted others recommending looking at Turkish Air.
Service has been very good and the food is quite good as well. There are many things to recommend it although the seats are old style side by side. However, I very much doubt I will use TA in the future unless the connections are so compelling and the price differential significantly compelling as well.
Why? I want to feel safe when traveling but the double and triple security checkpoints and the individual pat downs while standing at the boarding gate after you have already been through security twice as well as the individual bag opening at that same boarding gate were a bit much for me. I found the pat down particularly offensive. While mine was not as bad as some others, I saw one older woman almost manhandled by the female screener. Yes, she actually groped her private area in full view of everyone. I’ve asked a couple of other passengers if that was normal protocol but they were all newbies to TA and we’re just as surprised at it as I was.
For those who have flown TA in the past, any comments regarding this protocol would be appreciated. I wondered if there had been a particular threat or some chatter or the Boston destination caused some additional steps to be taken. Just letting folks know what my experience was today. And, yes, it was every single passenger who got on this plane who had the pat down. It wasn’t random.
Comments
Wow! I didn't experience this in 2020. I wonder whether there was some particular threat that day. You've done us all a service by posting this.
Every Muslim country I've been to has had over the top security - multiple screenings, patdowns, etc. In Egypt, we even had to get scanned LEAVING the Egyptian Museum. But the screening wasn't very good as they missed the mummy I smuggled out in my pants.
That said, you must have been profiled. Older white women are a particular threat
I’ve also been to Egypt, Jordan, Morocco, Dubai, and Israel where security is also very tight but I have never run into what I experienced today. And again, I wasn’t singled out, it was every single passenger who got on this plane.
We didn't experience any of that flying THY to and from J&E in March 2022. There was more security for the on-tour flights. Maybe it had something to do with the closely contested 14 May general election between the reigning 20 year current president and strongman Recep Tayyip Erdogan and two challengers that required a runoff on 28 May (Erdogan won.)
Security is usually done at the direction of or by national authorities, not individual airlines.
As to the seats. In addition to 2 - 3 - 2 seating on their (33) older 777-300ER and 2- 2 - 2 seating on their (36) A330-300, Turkish has newer aircraft like the (17) 787-9 and (13) A350-900 that have 1 - 2 - 1 seating up front. You just need to investigate which routes use them. For our J&E flights we flew out of Atlanta and back into JFK just for that reason.
Appreciate the info, Alan. I’m well aware of the election, the runoff and the results which were not surprising. It’s unfortunate because of all the geopolitical considerations that Turkey isn’t more popular with US tourists. I spent 2 weeks there and saw some incredible ruins, terrain and topography, learned a fair amount about their long and complicated history and stayed in some unique hotels. It’s a country well worth visiting.
I had half dozen internal flights within Turkey while there and did not have any extraordinary security procedures for the domestic flights, only the international. I will reach out to some of my fellow tour friends to find out what their experience was and to forewarn them as several of them stayed on.
Perhaps Tauck will take note at some point and put a tour together.
As far as investigating routes that fly specific planes, that isn’t my biggest concern. I know Boston doesn’t get the best planes but my priority is to get where I’m going as expeditiously as possible and clear customs ib Boston on my return. One connection is enough for me.
The minimal connections for J&E is what first pointed me towards Turkish (that and the great Turkish lounge at IST
). Since we fly out of RDU, it didn't make much difference as to our gateway city. I booked separate tickets on Delta using miles to get to and from ATL and JFK. I just had to ensure there was sufficient time to retrieve and re-check our bags and change airlines.
Question, did men get similarly aggressive checks and pat-downs? Something must have temporarily (and hopefully not permanently!) changed for security to react that way. Another thought- I don't know the current status, but Turkey was objecting to Swedish and Finnish membership in NATO. Turkey said Sweden, in particular, harbors what Ankara says are militants from the banned Kurdistan Workers Party (PKK), which took up arms against the Turkish state in 1984. That is holding a grudge for a bit too long. Erdogan is the main mover blocking membership for those two.
Thinking back the reaction is similar to Turkey's recent spat with Greece. Just a few years ago, Treasures of the Aegean could not dock in Kuşadası and tours were unable to visit Ephesus, one of the tour highlights.
Voikk32 -- I've been in touch with Tauck about Turkey. I had booked a tour with them in 2016, which they cancelled about a month prior to the starting date (and instead, I took the tour from which Alan just returned). They told me that they had only the cruise that has stops in Turkey, and had no plans to reinstate the land tour. I'm ready to book with one of their competitors (because I'm running out of time!).
Voik32…. Totally agree with you that Turkey is a fabulous destination! We went in September 2021 with a high-end competitor of Tauck, and loved every minute of it! The sites, the lovely people, and the food were all delightful. We flew Turkish business class out of Miami direct to IST, and the seats were wonderful, flat beds in private compartments. Perhaps we had a newer plane? ( agree on that fab IST lounge!)As far as the invasive pat downs we did not experience any of that. So sorry that happened to you.
Turkey is one of my favorite countries - history, culture, friendly people and good food! We went on a fabulous nine day tour of Istanbul with another tour company and then flew to different parts of Turkey on our own. We really liked Turkish Airlines. My son and daughter-in-law flew with them from LA to Istanbul and also liked them. None of us had any problems with security, although that was before Erdogan started cracking down. I sure hope security's aggressiveness is temporary.
I caught up with another woman in biz class at the luggage carousel in Boston and asked her if she had flown with Turkish Air previously. She said she had flown with them this past December and the pat down procedure was in place then. She didn't care for it either but it wasn't new as of yesterday. Not sure when it was instituted.
Marla526--I suspect you might have gone with the same high end competitor I traveled with. The trip was wonderful. My only complaint is that it could have been longer. Would have liked more time almost everywhere we went.
MCD--I felt the same way--I wanted to get there and had to do it when and with whom I could. Suggest that if you really want to go, another high end competitor will provide you with a good experience. There were 11 of us on the tour. Was supposed to be 13 but one couple dropped out at the last minute.
the moores--I was really hoping Turkish Air would be a good alternative for Qatar for some of my long haul travels to Africa and Southeast Asia. I'm glad you had a good experience but I will not go out of my way to fly them again.
AlanS--not sure how temporary this new protocol is if it's been in place since at least last December. I'm anxious to hear from my fellow travelers who stayed a couple of extra days what their departure was like. One couple was flying Delta through Amsterdam so could be different and others were flying IST to Dallas and another to Miami.
Voikk32 -- Please keep us informed of your fellow travelers' experiences.
Update--I've heard from my fellow travelers and they had the same experience as I did with the pat down at the gate and going through luggage at the gate. Perhaps it is a new US requirement within the last 7 or 8 months. If I hear from those who were traveling Delta via Amsterdam, I will let you know.
Suffice it to say, I will not be flying Turkish Air as an alternative to Qatar. I did not have this issue returning from Botswana via Doha in March. My next travel is in September to Paris returning from Venice on Air France.
Next long haul travel is to Vietnam in February. I've been exploring options out of Boston and back to Boston so I clear customs in Boston. Not a fan of Newark, JFK, DC, ATL, or any other city where I'd have to board a US based airline to reach my final destination. Not sure which one is worse--United, Delta or American. For me, it's a toss up. I saw some decent connections into and out of Boston through Japan Airlines. Wondering if anyone has used them and can comment. Also considering booking two one ways on different airlines to get the connections I prefer.
I flew from Boston to Hanoi and back on Emirates. Great flights, though at the time (2019) the business class configuration was 2-2-2. As a bonus, car service was included to and from my home, because it's within 50 miles of Boston. That "saved" me over $400 at the time.
I'm curious does Emirates have different levels of business class?
I've never flow Emirates, but I know Qatar does have several levels of business class. One of Qatar's more expensive business class options provides 'car service' to/from the airport. The lowest business class option on Qatar doesn't allow airport lounge access and certainly doesn't provide car service.
What I'm saying is that the $400 you saved on car service was likely factored into a higher priced business class ticket. Sounds like that was a good option for you, but let's be real Emirates, Qatar, etc. aren't known for having bargain basement business class ticket prices.
You're right about that, Smiling Sam, but you do get what you pay for with Qatar and Emirates. I just don't happen to like the connections. There is always a long layover for me, 8 or 9 hours and the overnight hours--so not really enough time to get a decent night's sleep and definitely not for sightseeing which I know some people do.
MCD--I've used that limo service as well with Emirates because I am also within 50 miles of the airport. It's a nice feature but Smiling Sam is right in that it is factored in to the price. And I do believe Emirates, like Qatar, has different options for business class fares.
I am interested in feedback on Japan Airlines which is part of the OneWorld alliance. It looks like lie-flat seats to/from Boston but not angled so may be 2-2-2, just like what I get on Emirates and Turkish Air. With Qatar out of Boston, you're never sure until you show up that day what kind of configuration you're going to get. Sometimes Q-suites, sometimes angled. Still for seating comfort, I think they're just about the best.
voikk32 - I can't speak to/from Boston for Japan Airlines, but I flew them to/from the Vietnam, Cambodia, and Thailand tour out of Vancouver, Canada and thought they were very good.
Thank you, Smiling Sam. What was your connection time in Tokyo? Looks like 1 hour 45 minutes for the flights I'd be interested in. Enough time to navigate the airport and get to the next gate? Have to go through customs? And, yes, this would be for my VCT trip in February.
voikk32 - FWIW, I'm doing the Vietnam trip in January and flying via Tokyo on United/ANA (though to DEN, not BOS). I recently did the Japan land tour and flew on similar flights. ANA has the best airplane food I've ever had (the Japanese meal).
Thanks, BKMD. ANA doesn't fly out of Boston so that means at least 2 connections for me. I'll pay more for the convenience of only 1 connection.
voikk32 - I don't remember exactly our connection time in Tokyo, but I do recall we had time to stop at the lounge and get some refreshments. If I had to guess, I'd say we had more like 3-4 hours.
If you have 1 hour 45 minutes, assuming your flight isn't delayed, I think you could easily make your next flight, but I wouldn't expect you'd be making a lounge stop. That said, I wouldn't feel comfortable with anything less than 90 minutes, so you don't have a lot of margin to my comfort window.
I apologize for the lack of detailed remembrances. We went in 2017.
I'd remember if there had been any issues like weird security, having to run through the airport, etc.
Thanks, Smiling Sam. I'd be more comfortable with 2+ hours so I'll keep researching.
Emirates now has different levels of business class, but I don't believe they had it when I flew them. I've been looking at them for an upcoming trip, and even buying the higher level of business class, it may be worth it to me because of the level of service provided by Emirates -- and because my car service has also increased its prices.
We took Japan Airlines from Boston to Hanoi and from Bangkok back to Boston. There were very good, with good connections in Tokyo.
In Boston business class can use British Airways Club, very comfortable. We would take Japan Airlines again, we have used them 2 x once to Tokyo, and once as described above.
Thank you so much, PF606590. That was exactly what I was hoping to hear. The connections looked pretty good to me and I like that they are part of the OneWorld alliance.
Voikk32, have you looked into Cathay Pacific? I flew them a few years back into Thailand for my Southeast Asia tour. There was a connection in Hong Kong….maybe they fly Boston to HK? Very nice business class 1,2,1 configuration.
I have flown Cathay Pacific, Marla526, and would love to fly them again. Will check if they are flying direct out of Boston these days. When I took them before, they weren't but that was quite a number of years ago. Thanks for the suggestion.
Smiling Sam For my upcoming India/Nepal tour, I'm flying Qatar (biz class) which I booked thru Amex. I love the Q-Suites (A350-1000)..surprisingly, the United flight was more than double the Qatar fare. I thought perhaps it was because I had 2-stops, but a friend is traveling from Newark and that flight was also priced ridiculously high.
PureLuxury - You’ll love Qatar, the QSuites, and the food is spectacular.
I’ve found that certain airlines have ridiculously high prices on some routes and then great bargains on other routes.
When I was looking into flights to SA for my upcoming tour, United’s prices were ridiculously high. Delta’s prices fell between United’s and American’s. These were to/from Tucson.
I know from other cities the order of airline prices would be different. To Asia, the Middle East, and Africa even more airlines get into the price picture.
Europe is probably the most competitive international market and therefore has the best price/flight options.
Smiling Sam I flew Qatar for my Jordan-Egypt tour. Yes, I was quite impressed with the comfort of the Q-Suites and the level of service from the flight attendants (and the wine was delicious--I am still searching for that bottle of African wine).
After my Q-Suite experience, a few months later I flew my beloved United Polaris to Athens and was a little disappointed --it simply doesn't compare with the Q-Suites